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Levels
May 21, 2005 1:18:42 GMT
Post by IvanHood on May 21, 2005 1:18:42 GMT
Next time you people logs onto AA, you should try go and advance your level Thanks to Paldin, we aren't stuck at 19 no more.
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Levels
May 21, 2005 9:30:29 GMT
Post by Lanstro on May 21, 2005 9:30:29 GMT
wimpied and lost 10k, my fav change so far
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Levels
May 21, 2005 10:12:22 GMT
Post by The Abyss on May 21, 2005 10:12:22 GMT
Nice HP/SPS now too, cheers Paldin still lose a level to a death? still quite nasty
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Levels
May 21, 2005 16:35:35 GMT
Post by tehlung on May 21, 2005 16:35:35 GMT
i think it was frosty last nite who said it best.(i was drunk so no memory)
'and people whined about power players before....'
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Levels
May 22, 2005 3:17:16 GMT
Post by Frostbite on May 22, 2005 3:17:16 GMT
Ok... so last night I couldn't figure out what it was that irk'd me about this new level system, I think in my sobriety I've figured it out.
On the surface, this is great - powerplayers can finally distinguish themselves from the rest of the pussies that "play" AA by sitting in the lodge playing the suck, fuck, and fondle game.
I finally realised what it is that's bothering me about it. Paldin has managed to push through code that has proven his exception to the process.
Type help levels, anything above level 19 has no title. Type help rank, it still refers to anyone level 20> as a mortal. Go and look for a critter that's level 20+, see if you can find one.
Now, answer me this - Would any other wizard (you know, one that hadn't bullied his way into the administrative arch-ship of three different positions not to mention countless committee positions) have been allowed to push code into the game with glaring documentary shortfalls and thematic lapses in reason?
Don't get me wrong, I think it's great that they finally made good on their promise to implement this. However, the glaring question in my mind is why is it that it was implemented in such a haphazard and incomplete manner?
Could it be the total uprising of powerplayers lately? Is this the bone that thye were willing to throw us to get us to stfu? If that's the case I sincerely hope that no one is fooled.
I honestly don't believe that Paldin is intelligent enough to make a strategic play of the above nature, and more to prove the point I think that this is simply another in his long string of failed implementations with partially completed code.
Paldin implemented the skills system - which is fantastic in its concept - minus the two weapon skill.
He then implemented the two weapon skill, two years later (after almost every fighter had spent 50% or better of their time dual wielding) with everyone starting at zero, because his code wasn't intelligent enough to account for time spent with two weapons prior.
Paldin implemented Shifters - worthless.
Paldin then continued to add forms and abilities in a futile attempt to bolster the value of said class - failed.
Now he's added additional player levels, with so much left to be desired.
Goddamnit man - Finish a fucking project before you implement it so that it makes sense. FOR ONCE!!!!!
Sorry, I think that this addition is too little, too late.
The proof in the pudding is simply this - I'm willing to bet $1,000 USD out of pocket that AA is offline before anyone reaches level 50.
Takers?
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Levels
May 22, 2005 10:32:10 GMT
Post by boogeyman on May 22, 2005 10:32:10 GMT
The proof is in the pudding that no matter what people try to do to improve the game you will instead complain about it. If you don't like the game - LEAVE! That is really all there is to it man. You aren't going to start a revolution. However, what you are very likely going to do is piss of the few remaining wizards who still code and take care of the game. I would say wiz and fix it yourself, but we all know how that turned out.
I'm admitedly not a huge fan of some of the admin, but I can see progress (and attempts at progress) when they show. The rest of the mud, or at least a majority, is excited about these changes. We see the glass as being filled, whereas you've already broken the freaking glass man.
Seriously, you need to get over it and yourself. It is a game, enjoy it or just stop playing.
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Levels
May 22, 2005 14:51:28 GMT
Post by Frog with feathers on May 22, 2005 14:51:28 GMT
I appreciate the new levels and I'm looking forward to getting them. Being able to gain 124HP and 124SP, carrying capacity, and more powerful class abilities all seems great at first glance, but for what purpose? When people get a high level, they just get an easier game, right?
The challenge of actually playing is less as players get a bigger HP buffer, carry more heals and get more power out of their class abilities. Death will probably become more of an issue and people might begin to wonder why they should play a gradually easier game with gradually increasing consequence for screwing up.
It's not going to be hard for people to get level 50, it will just be slow, and the same process as getting to level 19 (except you have more HP, and class power to do it).
I think this change might do more harm than good. A lot of people who know nothing about the game except what they found on the internet can already get a lot of experience, and we want to give bigger rewards for it?
These new levels don't do anything to create a challenge, they just make it easier and safer to kill stuff while the consequences for death keep rising.
Players are already winning when they get to level 19, and this change makes it even easier to win. The only challenge is that they have to keep winning for years before they get to the end of the game, and every so often they get more power against the same enemies they have beaten all along.
I don't see how this change helps unless more related code is on the way.
more briefly:
It was TOO EASY to max characters, so now it TAKES LONGER. Experience is easier to get as players gain class abilities and HP. Death is rarer because of the extra HP, and rare deaths means major disasters with our 1/3 system. The active killing part of the game gets easier, even it is harder to reach the end.
Has this dumbed down the act of getting high experience, made players stronger and taken away some challenge?
Anyone, (especially Paldin), want to explain to my slow little brain the rationale or the benefits of this levels change?
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Levels
May 22, 2005 17:26:15 GMT
Post by Pillar on May 22, 2005 17:26:15 GMT
boogeyman,
why doesn't frosty have the right to his opinion? surely you can see that paldin can have his as do you. if you don't like frosty's opinion, ignore it. don't tell someone to shutup or leave the game just because you disagree with them. we have enough people leaving as it is.
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Levels
May 22, 2005 17:55:30 GMT
Post by boogeyman on May 22, 2005 17:55:30 GMT
He completely has the right to his opinion. I just chose to match his sentiments and tone as I've seen in most of his posts. If his posts were more civil, so would mine be.
I have just as much of a beef with Paldin as he does. I disagree with most of the changes just as much. I just get tired of him being so negative towards it all. That isn't going to fix anything. I mean, what is your real goal? Running Paldin off?
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Levels
May 22, 2005 19:51:32 GMT
Post by Tempest on May 22, 2005 19:51:32 GMT
Froggy: An excellent note, my friend. Now, I hope I can maybe shed some light to help you see the big picture of this new addition. This new "package" of change that Paldin implemented may not sit right with most people because it's not a complete package. Now, let's look at the old way for a moment. Before, you were level 19, killing level 19 monsters and making level 19 xp. Now, you can be >19. So in the old way, you were theoretically higher than 19 (with mutliple millions of xp), yet your stats and abilities were stuck at level 19, and your kills were still level 19. In the new system, all that the level numbers changed were mental milestones. But, as you discussed, the hp/sp and some added power to the class abilities do raise the power of the character along with the level. Now, the last step is for wizards to code higher level monsters. Also, stats would have to be allowed to go higher. Then, the package would be complete. I should hope that new land areas could be created with level 20+ monsters for higher level players to move to. The "old" Anguish where you all play now would become the 1-19 training grounds for new characters, and the other areas would become the hunting grounds for 20+. So in all, these new changes are great as part of a package, but might not make complete sense until we get all of the new system in place. I know Paldin said stats would stay the same, but I think that's just for now since the monsters aren't going to be upped. Perhaps the stat maxes will be raised when new, higher level monsters are put into the game that call for higher stats.
I hope this helps and I haven't rambled on too much.
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Levels
May 22, 2005 22:25:47 GMT
Post by boogeyman on May 22, 2005 22:25:47 GMT
I can only imagine that the mud might just now shift to newer/harder monsters like Jush. I mean, before Jush was just SICK, but now he is like bazhi's plaything in the same way huge dragon used to be.. well not quite, but still.
I think that this is a step in the right direction.
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Levels
May 22, 2005 22:59:04 GMT
Post by Lanstro on May 22, 2005 22:59:04 GMT
In recent memory, there's been plenty of ideas that were half implemented.
Mickie's manspider area - implemented a few months before the spells Mandrakes - spells _still_ yet to arrive New nepeth - New nepeth stables
just to name a few
I'm glad the manspider area came a few months before the full package, so i could play with bolas. If this level thing is part of a big package, I'm glad it came before the rest, which might for all we know take a few more years (just look at the mandrake thing). Today i saw 2 big parties and 3 small ones and a few soloers running around that, that has to be good.
And regarding shifters, you know exactly what'd be coming out of your mouth his way if he'd made them powerful.
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Levels
May 23, 2005 6:30:33 GMT
Post by The Abyss on May 23, 2005 6:30:33 GMT
Gotta figure out all the changes now I definitely love my new hp/sps and more ritual damage. And Fury? Anyone try this out yet? Sounds interesting. Frosty: I don't think "it was implemented in such a haphazard and incomplete manner". Ok, the level titles for each level for each class don't appear to be changed for every level, but this is only a cosmetic thing which could easily be added in later. So far I think it's a great change for the mud and opens up huge possibilities. On a side note, I couldn't even find a decently stacked npc yesterday with all the parties running around
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Levels
May 23, 2005 14:18:33 GMT
Post by Frostbite on May 23, 2005 14:18:33 GMT
I actually agree that the addition is cool and a lot of fun.
What I am taking issue with is the fact that having gone through most of the approval process with a few projects and seeing what they require of projects before they are implemented, it feels like they made an exception for this project. I really doubt if any other wizard would have been allowed to implement this code without crossing the t's and dotting the i's. I realise that the documentation is cosmetic, but just like I was told by people doing the approval process on my own code:
"If it's just cosmetic, why not just get it done so it's no longer an issue" (Pretty sure it was Idul that offered up that bead of wisdom).
So the resounding question in my mind is this, "IF the code was pushed through in a rush and things were missed, why?"
The only answer that I can come up with is that the it was hoped to effect an attitude change amongst a group of people that were being very loud and very displeased.
Seems to have worked, esp since they Freed Frosty ;-)
So in a sense, I'm actually applauding their efforts, because at the moment, I'm pretty happy with AA and it seems (from the player population boom in the last two days) others are as well.
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Levels
May 23, 2005 16:20:30 GMT
Post by Tempest on May 23, 2005 16:20:30 GMT
Ok, the level titles for each level for each class don't appear to be changed for every level, but this is only a cosmetic thing which could easily be added in later. I have word that level titles are being worked on by multiple wizards as we speak. All wizards have been put to work on this change and fixing the bugs it caused. =) I also heard that Bytre's having to learn the mudlib since it's all new to him! Hahaha! =)
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